I am in no way a fan of tribal ways of life ;) The tribal system is based on total anti-individualism and to me, (in a certain way) individualism is almost a religion.
Oppression, loneliness, helplessness - all these works even better in a tribal or quazi-tribal sosiety than in capitalistic one, especially if you are looked upon as even a bit "strange" or a bit of outcast.
there is a splendid book about living in a real tribe:
That book doesn't deal with tribes which have adapted to living in the modern world though, which is the case here. 'Iwi' is the word for tribe in Maori, hence...
http://www.google.co.nz/search?q=site%3A.iwi.nz
Take your pick!
Hmmm - try this one: http://www.ngapuhi.iwi.nz/ Read the guest book - some of it's in English...
'pakeha' there refers to non-Maori - ie, I'm a pakeha.
I agree with you about the importance of individualism, but I don't see it as mutually exclusive in this case. And there's plenty of restrictions in a capitalist system - especially for the poor. Where do you live if you can't afford the rent?
I'll take a look, sure! tribal psychology is my favorite theme somehow.
but... there is nothing that good in the capitalist society.
but if you can't pay the rent, you'll live under a bridge, in a trash can, get to prison after all.
in a tribe in case you get into a serious conflict with the head of your household or the tribe in the whole - you are dead. fast and simple... in the best case, you are reduced to a non-human condition you can avoid here even living under a bridge (you can't always avoid it in the prison though).
I thought of this thread when I heard something about mental illness on the radio this morning. And I was able to find the archive for it, so listen here (http://www.radionz.co.nz/__data/assets/audio_item/0005/1580459/mnr-20080618-0627-Waatea_News-wmbr.asx) - about 1 minute into the recording. It's a very short piece.
A mental health commissioner says all New Zealanders could learn something from Maori about dealing with people with mental illness. Ray Watson says discrimination is one of the biggest challenges faced by those with mental health issues. He says many people still want to go back to the days when suffers were locked out of sight, but he doesn't see that among Maori. "Traditionally of course Maori communities are very accepting of difference, and so certainly in my experience in dealing with whanau and the hapu level or the iwi level Maori communities are very accepting of someone who's different in any way." Ray Watson says awareness campaigns like Like Minds Like Mine are having a positive impact.
Kind of the opposite of your: all these works even better in a tribal or quazi-tribal society than in capitalistic one, especially if you are looked upon as even a bit "strange" or a bit of outcast. comment, yes?
hmmm maybe I'm missing something, yes. I judge from what I've seen in my own life communicating with people loving in "simple" ways. in fact, I was someone slightly different and so beaten, humiliated and bullied in every possible way on a regular basis.
maybe I'm wrong somewhere extending "tribal ways" over anything that looks like primitive society... I have to give it a good thinking, yes. I'll do ;)
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branchandroot
(no subject)
Date: 2008-06-01 03:00 pm (UTC)The tribal system is based on total anti-individualism and to me, (in a certain way) individualism is almost a religion.
Oppression, loneliness, helplessness - all these works even better in a tribal or quazi-tribal sosiety than in capitalistic one, especially if you are looked upon as even a bit "strange" or a bit of outcast.
there is a splendid book about living in a real tribe:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helena_Valero (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helena_Valero)
It became a book of my life in a sense
(no subject)
Date: 2008-06-04 10:39 am (UTC)http://www.google.co.nz/search?q=site%3A.iwi.nz
Take your pick!
Hmmm - try this one: http://www.ngapuhi.iwi.nz/ Read the guest book - some of it's in English...
'pakeha' there refers to non-Maori - ie, I'm a pakeha.
I agree with you about the importance of individualism, but I don't see it as mutually exclusive in this case. And there's plenty of restrictions in a capitalist system - especially for the poor. Where do you live if you can't afford the rent?
(no subject)
Date: 2008-06-04 10:56 am (UTC)but... there is nothing that good in the capitalist society.
but if you can't pay the rent, you'll live under a bridge, in a trash can, get to prison after all.
in a tribe in case you get into a serious conflict with the head of your household or the tribe in the whole - you are dead. fast and simple... in the best case, you are reduced to a non-human condition you can avoid here even living under a bridge (you can't always avoid it in the prison though).
(no subject)
Date: 2008-06-18 06:00 am (UTC)I thought of this thread when I heard something about mental illness on the radio this morning. And I was able to find the archive for it, so listen here (http://www.radionz.co.nz/__data/assets/audio_item/0005/1580459/mnr-20080618-0627-Waatea_News-wmbr.asx) - about 1 minute into the recording. It's a very short piece.
(no subject)
Date: 2008-06-22 07:04 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-06-25 10:07 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-06-28 08:33 am (UTC)A mental health commissioner says all New Zealanders could learn something from Maori about dealing with people with mental illness. Ray Watson says discrimination is one of the biggest challenges faced by those with mental health issues. He says many people still want to go back to the days when suffers were locked out of sight, but he doesn't see that among Maori. "Traditionally of course Maori communities are very accepting of difference, and so certainly in my experience in dealing with whanau and the hapu level or the iwi level Maori communities are very accepting of someone who's different in any way." Ray Watson says awareness campaigns like Like Minds Like Mine are having a positive impact.
Kind of the opposite of your: all these works even better in a tribal or quazi-tribal society than in capitalistic one, especially if you are looked upon as even a bit "strange" or a bit of outcast. comment, yes?
(no subject)
Date: 2008-07-01 03:55 am (UTC)maybe I'm missing something, yes. I judge from what I've seen in my own life communicating with people loving in "simple" ways. in fact, I was someone slightly different and so beaten, humiliated and bullied in every possible way on a regular basis.
maybe I'm wrong somewhere extending "tribal ways" over anything that looks like primitive society...
I have to give it a good thinking, yes. I'll do ;)